Wendy 00:09

Hello, everyone. I'm Wendy Liebmann, CEO and chief shopper at WSL Strategic Retail, and this is Future Shop. This is where I talked to win innovators, disruptors, iconoclast about the future of retail. Many of you know that my underlying passion these days is about trying to figure out what modern companies and brands should be and how they should get there. So to talk to me about that today is my guest, Lisa Paley. Lisa Paley is the president of Haleon, North America. For those of you who don’t know the company, Haleon was the consumer division of GSK. And Lisa had the great good fortune, I think of actually starting almost with a white sheet of paper, but not quite, to create this new modern business. So welcome, Lisa, to Future Shop.

Lisa P 01:15

Well, thank you, Wendy. It's great to be here today.

Wendy 01:17

So as I said, those who listen to this program as you do Lisa, because you've had to listen to me forever, you know, I'm obsessed with this idea of what a modern business should look like now and in the future. And you've, you've had an interesting purview on that you've got an extraordinary background in the healthcare industries, through major companies that J&Js of this world, Pfizer Consumer. And here we are, in the new Haleon days, what do you see as the critical elements of a modern organization today?

Lisa P 01:49

I think it's a great question. And I'm intrigued, you know, Forbes defines five things actually, that a modern company contains. And I think whether you start with a list like that, that includes things like supports flexible work, you know, we have, for example, at Haleon, we have Hybrid at Haleon which talks exactly about that, like it's hybrid from the get go, the mindset is, you have to operate like a small company. That's what makes it modern, because that's what the colleagues and the consumers are wanting, how they want to engage and what they're finding fulfilling. It's also about that mindset of being small, nimble, very entrepreneurial, and regardless of your size. So that's how you have to behave, that's about behavior. Having sort of that founders’ mentality is really valued and modern companies, they talk a lot about prioritizing what you want versus what you need. And we have a value, you know, at Haleon, that's like, do what matters most, you're really trying to tell people we get that you're living in this very busy, complex world today. And you're gonna have to continue to be hyper prioritized in order to be effective, you know, of the things that you're trying to accomplish. People who value the voice of the customer, who value the voice of colleagues, those are really resonant in modern companies, because you really have to keep your finger on the pulse with them. So you have to be really in tune to that. And finally, I would say just those companies that are really astute at adapting to change, and understanding that, you know, the the pace of change does change continues to accelerate that what you do about that, and how you free people up to move at that pace. So you don't want to be as over prescriptive, you want a little more policy, less laws, you know, like those kinds of things that allow people to respond at the pace of the change that they need to. So those are some of the elements, you know, that we look to. And we've had the real privilege as we started this to begin with a modern slate. So we've been encouraged, you know, we've been able and fortunate to be able to do that.

Wendy 03:41

What's interesting to me is, you know, you talk about a founder mentality. And I think on the one hand, there was that moment, I assume, when you know, all the legal stuff was sorted, or almost sorted, the financials was sorted. And you could theoretically sit there with a white sheet of paper and say, Okay, now what, but you also have very established brands, you know, everything from Advil and Emergen-C and Excedrin, Flonase, which is one of those days today, Flonase kind of day. But to do that with established brands, and a potentially new culture, what did that white page founder mentality look like when you then step back to step forward?

Lisa P 04:27

Yeah, that's a really, again, a really insightful question, because that's exactly what we had to do. We had to say, like, what are we starting up this new organization with? We had tremendous brand assets. As you mentioned, we had a real strength in, you know, our trusted science and in our deep human understanding that we, you know, leverage with consumers. We didn't want any of that to go away. We needed to parlay that into the new organization. But there were many of those entrepreneurial things too. We did. For example, embark on setting up a new culture and we did revamp our strategy in the flywheel of success, you know, that Haleon was going to use versus where we have been in the past. And I think most importantly, you know, we got very intentional about what our new purpose was going to be. And getting to that north star has made a tremendous difference. And that's how we were able to bring I think so many people on this transformational journey was really understanding what that purpose was going to be.

Wendy 05:24

So talk a bit about that. Because you know, I remember you stood on the stage at NACDS, last year or the year before, and it was before, everything was totally separate. But you made a speech that really was very moving, when it was great to see a woman on the stage, the other woman who believes in lipstick, thank you very much, but also who talked, who talked about the sort of the need for humanity within brands and companies. And you talked about sort of you anticipated this purpose that you've now created with Haleon and this sort of Health and Humanity. And it struck me then that it was a very different voice. So how do you get that on the white piece of paper? And then how do you bring that through the organization? And quickly because you've basically done it within the last, what, 12 months or so?

Lisa P 06:15

Yeah, absolutely. So it took a minute to perfect the purpose, I'll say, right, to get it exactly where we wanted it. But we knew we were in the right space, again, by the resonance of the people that we were socializing it with, and the playback and what they were feeling as a result of it and our purpose, you know, very clearly stated as to deliver better everyday health with humanity. So you're right, we put that word humanity in at a time when this world probably never needed it more, you know, like it was so much going on. But ours is really rooted in that everyday health care, too. And that was really important. But when you wake up, and you go, wow, like, that gets to be our purpose. And you can feel good about living that purpose every day, and genuinely helping people. So we get to do it as a business at Haleon on but we get to do it as an industry as well. And I think that really fueled people, they really saw the power in just making incremental changes in the day-to-day behavior of consumers that genuinely gives them better wellness, or better overall health. And that's a really strong aspiration. And when we did it, it was for everybody, everybody was included. So it's a very inclusive purpose, as well. And we think that really matters in today's society, also.

Wendy 07:29

That was a really unique Wait, your use of the word humanity on that stage was so compelling to me, for several reasons. We had done I think some of your team were actually there, a summit that we call The Big Business of Well, just before the pandemic, and we had an architect, Dawn Clark, who actually is going to be on this podcast in a couple of weeks. And Dawn was designing the new Nordstrom store on 57th Street and responsible for store redesign coming out of Starbucks, and other very iconic retail brands. And she talked about building creating a human store. And it was this sense of human and humanity. Yes, pre pandemic. And as you said, in the middle of the pandemic, that created a very different voice. So it's one thing to find the word right, and isn't that great, but it is the other to imbue an organization with the power of that, as well?

Lisa P 08:28

Well, one, I'm always impressed with what you find on the street. So I always follow that, because you're always right on trend, I think the fundamental underlying insight that people are finding is that you have to treat the whole person, and you can't just take a context or because you sell a brand, or you sell one product. And I mean, that's not how they think about it or experience that they think about it in the context of their whole person, their whole family their whole life. And so I think as you come up with the view over the consumers, and you incorporate that more genuinely, and authentically, I think you get to different outcomes. And I think that's probably what you were starting to hear, you know, on the stage that day, and that was the lens that we were looking through. And then we've spent that time finding partners who have similar value systems and who also want to make these differences. And then you start to amplify, right, your potential to make a big positive impact on it. So that's a lot of you know, what we've been spending the last year since the inception, doing.

Wendy 09:24

So when you talk about partners in that context, are you talking about your customers, your retail partners? Is that what you mean?

Lisa P 09:30

They're definitely one of the most important partners that we have, we have a lot of them and we believe that you need to be really in tune with the retailers, in which case our our customers, the types of customers that we have, we serve consumers or shoppers, but really, you know, we do most of that through retail partners. And we know that many of them are on the same journey. Not only are they really wanting the wellness, you know, for society, but for their colleagues for their shoppers, but they want to make this positive social impact as well. And I think joining up at those strategy levels and really understanding the social impact that you can have, when you jointly work together to make bigger differences, we think is one meaningful way to work with retailers, for sure, we had to bring them on a journey, though, this was a big change, right? A big company, one of their larger partners in the health and wellness department. And, and so we did also spend a lot of time just really being thoughtful about making sure that we were clear what our journey was, and who we were going to be for them, and that they could count on us for very certain things, you know, when we got to be Haleon on outside of GSK. And what we were promising what we're living in was really resonating with them.

Wendy 10:38

Yeah, that's the other part. To me, that always strikes me, you're preaching to the converted, that the collaboration of that's the right word between consumer customer as in we would call shopper, and then retailer, and then your internal colleagues. Right. So in that context of all of that modern, flexible, agile founder generated company, there are a lot of facets to that, that you have to keep up, hold on. Right?

Lisa P 11:09

Yeah. I mean, you just hit the three things that when things speed up, that's where I reground myself and reorient, you know, what, in the midst of everything that we're trying to do and solve, what does it mean to the consumer? How do we benefit that consumer and delight them through experiences? How do we partner with the retailers in the mix? Right? Because they're gonna go experience and get the services and products somewhere? And then is it right for colleagues, you know, do colleagues feel good about that work they're doing? Are they doing it in the ways that they can rest well, at night, knowing they always can do the right thing. And that's what's rewarded, you know, at our company, and, and then also be able to grow, like, really get serious about new ideas and ways that we can really move around those experiences, or those consumers or those retailers. And so, you know, they have a real growth mindset that's come with this transformation as well. And so that's exciting, you know, when you start to combine those things, but definitely grounding and what I call the three C's, and it's got to be about the consumer, the customer being a retailer, and then the colleagues. And when you get right for them, you are going to be really well on your way to doing something pretty special.

Wendy 12:18

So we forget the three P's for the moment, because they're just not incidental, but more tactical, right? And we can think about the three C's, which is, which is I love that as a whatever it is not mnemonic, something easy to remember three C’s, because you had an established and successful brand portfolio, did you have to go back and say of each brand, or each segment of business you're in where does that fit within this delivering everyday health with humanity? Did you have to think about that differently to tick off the box, and then think about what's totally new?

Lisa P 12:53

Yeah, actually, we evaluate it all the time. You know, we think about our portfolio, I think we were really fortunate if you remember, it was, you know, an aggregation of a couple of different mergers, very large companies, but with a real intent to be in that health and wellness space. So we were fortunate that we had also done, you know, the proper pruning along the way just to make sure it was a really fit for purpose portfolio. And those brands really represented the things that are helping people on an everyday basis. So we're no longer you know talking prescriptions, we're no longer talking, you know, sort of these one off things, we're talking about the things that are in daily regimen, or in quick recovery of daily, you know, incidences of cough, colds, or pain or things like that. And I think, you know, being really clear, and having that really aligned has helped us go faster. We didn't have a lot of pruning that needed to be done, because we were already sort of, we have been pretty intentional about getting this portfolio to where it was along the way. And I think that helped us be ready for day one. Now, the brands you have to bring, right, so that's what the consumers resonate with. They love the brands, they know the brands, they're less interested in the consumer space about the corporate name on the packages for the most part. So we get a little bit of time to transition that behind the scenes. But we're very good partners, for example, with like medical professionals, or doctors and dentists. And with them, we had to make sure we were going to have credibility as Haleon as a standalone. Because if we're honest, there was probably a lot of halo from GSK that gave us credibility, you know, coming into the Haleon on experience, but sure enough, like building trust by making sure that we brought them also on the journey and transformation. They've also been big supporters of Haleon and really, you know, looking forward to hailing on success and the things that we'll be able to do additionally and differently as a consumer company.

Wendy 14:40

It is interesting you say that, because there continue to be a lot of these divestitures of pharmaceutical companies separating from their consumer businesses. And you do always step back and wonder how much that halo of the Big Pharma for good and for bad, excuse me for being direct, but good and for bad have to play on the consumer side of the business. And when you stand on your own two feet, then that issue and as I think about I forgot about the oral care obviously Sensodyne, and those businesses, when you've got a lot of professionals that are part of the culture of the brand, that's also part of that partnership, right, that you have to have those people on side too.

Lisa P 15:22

Yeah, and I think, you know, you talked about there was good and bad. And there definitely was, I mean, you know, we're in the vitamins and minerals space. And, you know, that was something that is less regulated, if you will, has less requirements from a medical standard, we take the highest standard in the science and we prove, you know, the things that we do put into the market, but it is could have been over engineered from a pharmaceutical company perspective, and then to be able to come and be separated. And, you know, that is something that we look at and just say are we fit for purpose for the market and the businesses that we're in? So we'll be looking, you know, how do we make the proper adjustments and the tweaks and the ways that we operate in order to really advance you know, the VMS categories as well, you know, it

Wendy 16:04

feels now I mean, where is Haleon, at this point in time, where it's kind of at the vortex of so many fast changing consumer expectations around health and wellness, about affordability, which is I think, the point you made, also on that NACDS stage a couple of years ago, sustainability, technology, trends and shopping. How do you have to then, you talked about speed and flexibility and sort of founder mentality, but how do you take that all of these emerging trends and think about them as you continue to refine this perfectly, modern Milly? Nobody will know that show, anyway, whatever that show. But you know, this notion of a modern company, a modern organization?

Lisa P 16:49

Yeah. And I think this is where you blend the purpose and the performance of the company, right, and where those things meet up. And the way that we, we think about that is, you know, we really are developing our brands with purpose. And so how we resonate in and how do we accomplish the purpose by making it more accessible to people? So just broadening the people that are getting the exposure, you know, to the brands and products that we offer? How do we make sure it's more inclusive? Right, so we did something, you know, for example, with Seeing AI. Because if you have visual problems, you may not be able to even read the label, think about how important understanding, you know how to take a medicine or a vitamin or something is right. So we really partnered in that case with a technology firm, in order to bring that to the surface as an example. And then finally, you know, we put that through what we want to be achievable. And so people set goals were again, working on these daily goals, but how do we help them achieve those aspirations that they have just for that everyday health. And we had really good opportunity to do that, for example, during COVID, with the immune protection, and really helping people understand how to use immune support, and a daily regimen in order to be better protected against, you know, something that was affecting us all. So we've had lots of opportunity, we really believe in this. Everybody's welcome at our table, we say it all the time we mean it. And then how do we bring them in and support them, you know, from a health care or wellness perspective. And so that's kind of how it all comes into the market from our lens.

Wendy 18:22

So that sense of humanity is not just one kind of lump umbrella, or excuse my inelegance, but that sense of how does humanity play out being human within the context of the category, or the brand, or the consumer patient at the time? Is that how you think about

Lisa P 18:42

it? That is how we think about it. And I would add one more, which is colleagues. So again, we welcome all of that, and we say, Yeah, but I think you know, people are doing it so well to different degrees. And I think how authentic is it to your culture? So it's something that we talk openly about all the time, it's something that we embrace, encourage, support, lean in on, you know, so it's a really big piece of what's becoming, you know, Haleon’s DNA, and we are really, you know, proud of the company for the progress that we've been making in that regard. Again, be it for the shoppers, be it for the in the consumer state or be you know, for a colleague,

Wendy 19:18

you know, I will tell you just as an aside since it’s only you and me talking, ha ha. That as you know, we do a lot of retail executive interviews for a variety of clients in a variety of spaces and, and recently doing some work for a client who, when you ask about who's getting it right these days, I hadn’t shared this with you before, and it wasn't for you but Haleon comes up as a company that's getting it right and it struck me is that not being just your cheer squad, but that timeframe. There's been a very short timeframe. So that ability to do a lot within a very short time of this new company. Obviously, whatever you're focusing on first, second, third, is resonating with some of your key retail customers.

Lisa P 20:09

Well, you know, I will find no higher compliment than that. So we could end right there. I'd be very, very pleased today.

Wendy 20:15

Now I'm going to ask you the hard question now that I've just softened you up. So you know, from your end, there been some sort of good and bad learnings from this last year? 18 months in, not bad, but surprises or things that you said, oops? Or do we need to refine that? Or if I were advising companies, in this sort of form? What would I be telling them to keep an eye out for?

Lisa P 20:40

Yeah, well, we know, we know people are going through similar processes. Look, if we didn't take lessons from it, we wouldn't have got had the full experience, right? So it was never about everything going perfect. It was that everything had to go well, right. And there's a difference. And I think, where you allow yourself the room, this isn't done very often, you know, this is a very rare occurrence to take a company this large and transform it into something totally new. And so there weren't tons of examples out there. But I will say the things that went well, lots of planning, huge pressure, like in the tech organizations and things like that, you know, where technically it has to go right. And they did you know, so knock on wood, thank goodness, all that happened, you know, as planned, and credit to the company for being very well orchestrated. The purpose, you know, we're doing it's live, it's a live show. So it's got to be working as you go. And it's not like you get do over. So you have to be good listeners, right? Do you have your finger on the pulse? Is what you're trying to accomplish working? And if not, are you doing course corrections in real time. And I would say, that was probably the learning, just make sure you're continuing to move your organization at the pace you need to, but don't forget about change management. And don't forget, everything doesn't stick, you know, the first time. So sometimes you have to go back, catch it up, and then, you know, keep moving. And I think we were good at that we were very iterative and how we got to where we were going. But we were also, as I mentioned to you very focused on that purpose. And then the other piece is the performance, right? So you know, much like you have a purpose piece of the business that's going to guide you, the performance has to be there, like it's all about, are we establishing our credibility as a standalone organization, that was paramount. And still, it's because we're still in the early stages. So we also got really focused on making sure that we have the right performance flywheel. So we spent a lot of time getting that etched out and helping, you know, continue to train and of all people to be able to operate around that new flywheel. And again, we're still, you know, early days, but we're, we're very happy and pleased with where we've come so far. And we know we have lots still to do as a new company.

Wendy 22:44

The other thing that strikes me this, this is a very large global organization. So North America, in its own ways is challenging. But when you think or you participate in that bringing this global company to life, the challenges around the world that you see, you're surprised at, are they similar to what you see in the US? Or are they different, different cultures, different countries,

Lisa P 23:09

there are definitely many differences around the globe, if you just think like during COVID, people were in all different stages of that, right, like somewhere opened up somewhere shut down, it didn't matter. We were moving, you know, so how they could celebrate or what they celebrated with looked a little bit different, for example, like on day one, but I was never more impressed, Wendy than like seeing the whole globe in their way, celebrate this newfound company. And it was amazing going into a new brand, a new corporate logo, a new color scheme, a new purpose, a new this new performance piece we talked about, and yet all of that translating around the globe with enough similarity that you knew it was Haleon, and you knew it was gonna stick. And I loved it. I mean, you saw some countries were like dancing with joy, literally dancing with joy, because that's how they celebrate something really big like this. We got to go to the stock exchange, that was a unique opportunity. And so there were these really momentous things. One of the cool things that we did, we created founders walls in North America and everybody who was there on day one got to sign this. And we think that's a pretty cool way to like, put your mark on the fact that, yes, we did come in with a lot of brands, we did come in with a lot of things as a company to get started. But we also are at day one, and everybody that's here as part of that founding team, we really wanted them to feel a part of a company that way.

Wendy 24:26

So moving forward, the areas I mean, it sounds like the people within the organization, I think about the really, I mean, we see you know, from from afar, as both consumers of the brands and people within the industry sort of glossiness I mean that in a very positive way, obviously, but the continuing hard work of the culture and training and all of those things that we don't necessarily get to see, what are the priorities there again, in a modern company, what do you need to be doing there, or are you doing that you can talk about that sort of reflect that. You talked about iteration on all of that.

Lisa P 25:08

So I mentioned, maybe we're going to click deeper here, but I mentioned those cultural values, right? The ones that we selected or go beyond, which is really keep that external lens, make sure you know, you know where you are, versus the market and your competition and how your consumers are shifting and really being externalized. While we have a lot of, you know, internal things to do, do what matters most. And this is about like, sort of that maniacal prioritization that's required in the world. So that's on an individual level. So they're very empowered at an individual level to do that prioritization. We also encourage leaders to find the things that we are prioritized around as a group or team or a company, so that those are always clear and in front of the people. And then the third one is keep it human. And so reminding ourselves that while we're moving at this crazy, intense pace, or going through this major transformation, at the end of the day, we're all people and we need to treat each other, you know, with that respect to that humanity, and the way that we do things, and that's a big piece of the culture. So the way that we stay true to that then is, you know, we take surveys, we do huddles where we're listening, leaders are listening, keeping fingers on the pulse, you know, of the way that the company is progressing. And for me, it's about those real time remediations, right, like not letting things become bigger deals than they need to be. And staying in really good open communication with colleagues.

Wendy 26:30

And maybe last you play an external role within the community that you're a part of in the healthcare community and the retail community, whether it's with CHPA, known as CHPA, for some of us as the new chairperson, obviously, on the stage of NACDS, WE, which is something you and I are on the board of which supports the growth and development of women in the health and wellness industries. I know that's important to you personally, how important is that to the culture you're creating, and the way you think about building talent and expectations within the within the Haleon organization?

Lisa P 27:07

Yeah, I mean, I do think it is one, I do love the industry. So I'm happy to do a lot on behalf of it. And for it, and I do personally get a lot of satisfaction out of the people I meet and the relationships that are developed and, and the opportunities that that creates. But as importantly, it is also demonstrating that importance of being involved in the external environments, and making sure that we don't get insulated, that you have this, I call it like externalize, you know our company, because it's so important to not get to focused on your own things that you forget about the bigger picture of who you're serving and, and where you're serving. And I think you've got to be out in the markets, you've got to be out in these industries, you've got to be out with customers and with third parties, partners that you're with, and, and keep looking for the trends and the inspirations and the ways that you continue to be better. And then how do you also keep your brands, which is one of our biggest assets, how do you keep them relevant and all that context? And again, the rule just changes so quickly, that now that context, you got to stay really current with it right, in order for that relevance to remain. So we really do bring it back in, we expect it of our people. It's actually part of our leader behaviors that we expect, and of leaders and yeah, we take that one pretty seriously.

Wendy 28:23

So last, I promise this is the last question, is there one thing you would say to anybody going through this, I don't mean, divestiture. But you know, thinking about a thoroughly modern company, that you would say, Oh, gee, do not do this. The one thing?

Lisa P 28:39

Well, the one thing I would say definitely do do is make sure that that purpose is clear. And that you can come back to it often. And the one thing you know, maybe not to do is to sweat all the small stuff that you're going to encounter doing it. Because you got to stay really focused on the big picture. Because there's lots of little things, right, it takes I mean, 1000s upon 1000s of moving parts for this to all, you know, come together. And rather than, you know, get too distracted with any one of them, just keep everybody focused on the big picture and the goal and the desire. And I think linking that to purpose, backing it up by performance is probably the best way to you know, come through one of these with some success.

Wendy 29:18

Well, that's a perfect way to end the discussion because you make it look easy, the swan paddling madly underneath. But I know the complexity of this. We've seen it in lots of industries, not just health where companies have separated out and the challenges of doing that. And you and team have done it at a time when there was supply chain issues, a pandemic first, supply chain issues.

Lisa P 29:41

That's probably another podcast but yes, we'll come back and talk about that later. Yeah,

Wendy 29:45

all by itself, right? Yeah. all by itself on that flywheel of success, just getting product on the shelf, right, that sort of thing, which is sounds so basic, but.. I really appreciate this, this sense of modernity and how we have to think about it growing businesses in a very contemporary way, and not looking backwards, very easy to do and a healthcare industry that's so pressured by the legal the legal pressures of being in a healthcare industry. But I think this is a very good roadmap for all of us who are thinking about, what should tomorrow look like? Or maybe what should today look like?

Lisa P 30:20

So can we even say no? So thank you so much Wendy. I really appreciate it. Real pleasure.

Wendy 30:24

Thank you, Lisa. And look forward to seeing you very soon, very soon. Take care. Cheers. So here's the thing, she says, breathing out, you know, Lisa made that sound seamless, I won't say easy. But what was very clear in the conversation we had is that this holistic view of a modern business very much, you know, founder based thinking about, as she says, the three C's, the internal colleagues, the consumer who drives the business and customer retailer, and having that connection between all three when you build a new business, a contemporary business for the future, whether it's health and humanity, or it's some other category delivered with a purpose. Clearly that agility, that clear articulation of what you stand for, and how you bring your internal teams on that journey is so fundamental to building a modern consumer and retail and service business, a business of any kind. So I'm still on that road. I'm still passionate about untangling what building a modern business means. So look forward to talking to you more about that in the future. See you there.